Hello page 3. Just testing.
The M-DSPD IA Investigation
That was fast 🙂
LandauMurphy, Thanks for the information on page 2 about Trayvon threatening to kill his mom. It is much appreciated!
Thanks from me, too! Here’s the info from page 2:
@Dawn Doe: AFAIK, the information originated at http://forums.leoaffairs.com/viewtopic.php?f=65&t=144714&p=985712&hilit=Trayvon+martin#p984831, where the poster “interestedparty” is asking LEO’s (or other posters on that forum) for information on, among other things, “Previous threats by Trayvon Martin to kill his mother.” The phrasing would seem to indicate that the poster is aware of at least one threat, but I have no information beyond that, and we all know that this case is rife with rumors in varying degrees of plausibility.
This is just my thoughts, but I was thinking that “interested party” was SD. First time I read, thats what I thought, then there is a comment to “interested party” kinda leading them where to “look” JMHO
Also “interested party” has made several comments in various threads going back to last year.
I thought it was SD, then I remembered another poster who seem to have some inside knowledge about TM and his difficulties.
It just seemed to me from knowing SD was doing research and the way the questions were posted. Also I think there is a person named LOU who seems to know alot about TM school stuff or TM some how. I still stick with it being SD, again JMHO and I havent read way far back but will.
I know about Lou he lives in the Miami Area, but the poster I was talking about was not him, and he seemed some precise inside information about TM. IMO it was this poster tipped SD to the MSPD story.
Oh ok, sorry I guess I missed that. Thanks.
Please don’t apologize, I just recall the poster, he briefly, but with specific information. I thought that he either worked at the school or was a social worker.
For some reason I KINDA REMB that, but I hate to misidentify someone on purpose. thats why I said IMHO 🙂 I betcha its a combination of it, truth be known.
Of that I have no doubt.
Are you thinking of strat4ever or something similar?
I just read about the Boston bombing hijack by Team Skittles. They are SHAMELESS!! Sybrina and Tracy and Crump have to make everything about them. I’ve never seen such scummy people before, ever! They make Bernie Madoff look like a nice guy.
It is absolutely shameless. The editor of Global Grind tried to get the boy’s name trending just a few hours before the story in the New York paper broke. Then the Martin/Fulton family issued the statement. You’ll note Global Grind, Russell Simmons, Michael Skolnik on #Martin Richard but only one post from Global Grind on the other known person who died, Krystle Campbell. They are absolutely disgusting.
No 8 year old boy should die in vain. Let's get #MartinRichard trending! Remember his name! #Boston RT!
— Michael Skolnik (@MichaelSkolnik) April 16, 2013
No 8 year old boy should die in vain. Let's get #MartinRichard trending! Remember his name! #Boston RT!
— Michael Skolnik (@MichaelSkolnik) April 16, 2013
From what I heard Bernie Madoff was a nice as long as he did not have your money! Global Grind and by extension the family are shameless, and those that are defending the family as if they did nothing wrong are either clueless or just as scummy and shameless.
They are just trying to put Trayvon’s name on this. It sickening. When I read down the hash tag and read Trayvon’s name I am furious. I’m understanding more and more why Trayvon attacked George if these two parents raised him.
I saw that too, I could not believe it, do they really feel the 2 situations are equitable? If they do then, I agree with you.
Just as Jamie Foxx wore the TM/Sandy Hook t-shirt to the MTV awards, Foxx promoted himself, got an interview and millions viewing the t-shirt. The appalling thing to me is WHY an 8 yr. old is supporting TM despite the facts in the case? Did his parent’s use the incident to explain the white-Hispanic MISTREATED the black kid, or racially profiled? WHY would parent’s be so ill informed and share their ill informed opinion w/an 8yr. old? Did the child hear it at school? Since the 8 yr. old is too young to have an informed opinion about this case, whose opinion was he promoting?
I am scared to death for GZ/family, while I want to trust our Judicial system, I see it fail many times, it failed the Zimmerman family as Mrs. Z pointed out. But it is voir dire that I continue to worry about, I worry IF 6 jurors will do the right thing, make a decision on the evidence and disregard everything else. The jury took a beat down in Casey’s case, some moved, some were threatened, a couple moved out of State. Although imo, they made the wrong decision and promoted their lack of understanding in media interviews, they suffered a back lash and harassment personally. Potential jurors living in Fla. surely read about past juror’s, doing the right thing in this case will no doubt have repercussions for the jury.
I believe this story is entirely made up. The photo of the boy with his poster went viral. I am beginning to think someone saw that message and the month the poster was created (April 2012) and decided it may be an opportunity to get Trayvon’s name in the news with it.
There is no mention of Trayvon Martin in the article that was written about the kids posters and their peace walk. The 2nd grade class all made up posters calling for peace in April 2012 in preparation of the peace walk they took to City Hall asking the legislators to “stop the violence”. Someone took license that Trayvon Martin case inspired it. Over time, I think we will learn it did not. Here is the story that was in the paper of it on May 17th. No mention of Trayvon Martin. http://www.boston.com/yourtown/news/dorchester/2012/05/pictures_dorchester_students_m.html
His message was part of a school lesson on the shooting of Trayvon Martin last year, according to a Facebook post by Richard’s former teacher Rachel Moo.
Lucia Brawley, a friend of Moo, posted Martin’s photo on Facebook and it has received nearly 93,000 shares in less than a day. “My prayer is that we all live by Martin’s words, paying tribute to his too-brief, but immeasurably valuable life by following his example,” wrote Brawley.
Look at her likes, maybe she has an agenda.
Make sure you scroll down on the likes. You’ll see Justice for TM & Prosecute the Killer of TM
Here’s a little insight into Lucia Brawley post Trayvon: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/lucia-brawley/open-letter-to-president-_b_920026.html
From your link:
My daughter Bianca is only 10 months old and she is already walking like a champ. She’s so determined. I want to know that the America she inherits is more lustrous, not tarnished, than the America in which I grew up.
I will fight for you in the upcoming campaign with everything I have, in order to prevent a Republican, or unthinkably, a Tea Party candidate from winning the presidency. But in order to fight for you again, I have to know you’re fighting for Bianca and me. Because if not you, then who?
It appears that a former prosecutor, who was walking from Boston to Florida to protest the non-arrest of George Zimmerman, inspired the kids’ teacher, Ms. Moo to teach the kids about ‘activisim’.
The class made the posters and walked with the TM activist on April 9, 2012. http://www.boston.com/yourtown/news/dorchester/2012/04/hold_with_zimmerman_charged_in.html
In May, the teacher arranged a peace walk again for the kids to march on City Hall with a message to “stop the violence”.
It seems like I read that Shellie has a hearing today, does anyone know it thats correct? TIA
Does anyone recall what Judge N is to rule on at the next hearing? I know the sanctions for the State are at issue for Judge N to rule on, the deposition of Crump is on appeal, it seems the Defense needs to file another MOTION requesting the trial date be moved due to needing more time. The second 1/2 of DD’s deposition is to be done (I think,) I am assuming after Crump’s deposition if the appeal is granted, if the appeal is denied, it still has to be done.
Since a lot of information is not released to us, it’s hard to know what has & has not been delivered to the Defense they requested in past Motions. I had hopes that Gutman would do the right thing but that isn’t likely to happen since the assinine tone Gutman took w/RZ Jr. on twitter.
The Judge ruled to have Shellie’s case heard after George’s trial. http://www.cfnews13.com/content/news/cfnews13/news/article.html/content/news/articles/cfn/2013/4/17/judge_delays_shellie.html
WTF sense does that make?!?! She better have put forth some damn good reasoning because it looks more and more like Shellie’s being used against George. I swear the whole fucking system is corrupt and worse still in Florida.
you got that right, dude!
yes, but in a way she is giving Shellie a break. Judge Nelson is saying that she is not going for the state’s use of Shellie to force gz to cop a plea or otherwise prejudice his case. this is a huge break for gz and shows that Judge Nelson has found religion, probably because her last ridiculous decision is now squarely before a higher court. maybe there is hope after all!
I agee that she can now be used against George. I was hoping that Shellie’s case would be decided before George goes to trial. Mainly, I wanted her to already be sentenced if she is found guilty. I worry about “public Interest” influencing the judge after all hell breaks loose when George is found innocent. The mob is going to be screaming for her head.
I believe this is good news, if Shellie is acquitted before the trial of GZ it would hurt the prosecution.
imho, Judge N MAY give BDLR a tongue lashing over the sanctions which is an utter waste of time but NOT impose a monetary punishment, Judge N surely wouldn’t want to embarrass Bondi, Corey, and embarrassment may be lost on BDLR.
For BDLR, is it the quiet before the storm for the State?
let’s hope judge nelson is beginning to see the light here. she was being played by BDLR, big daddy Blackwell (what an ironic name, no?) and the Crumpster. Crump’s oral argument is going to be great entertainment for Judge Ma’am. he should hopefully get his butt handed to him by MOM/West.
this is going to be one great movie someday!
in re: tracy and sybrina ” Blood’s not thicker than money. ” -Groucho Marx
Would I be wrong to assume that the defense pretty much now has all that it needs. Granted we could see a filing much closer to the 4/30 hearing. We ourselves have seen little to nothing regarding the phones/pings, etc., but I’m thinking as I look at the calendar that they have surged through the deps and have all the evidence needed. If they don’t have the all the evidence they need I would expect the time is NOW to say something so that can be fixed. So what do you think … do they have pretty much everything or not?
Please keep in mind I’m speaking of everything OTHER THAN the Crump dep and what will be garnered from that.
Yes, I believe your are right, I don’t know why the decision was made to keep the pings logs secret, but the press is not pressing the issue so we will have to wait until trial for a reveal. If the press were to file a motion requesting that information be released as it falls under the Sunshine Laws it might be released before.
Gosh, I’m worried that MOM/West won’t be able to mine the ping log information from every angle without the public helping them, or the rest of the evidence for that matter! Scary thought!
After the Feb.5th Hearing he said that they would need to hire a expert. I am hoping that they did. IMO the information is inconclusive, that is why has not been released.
@boricuafudd, if MOM has the ping logs, he really needs to let waltherppk get at them, doncha think? Walther has been almost slavering as he waits and waits and WAITS for the dang ping logs, and he DESERVES to be let loose on ’em! Sure, I’d hire an expert as well if I could afford it, in MOM’s shoes, but considering the calibre of intel at the CTH, IMO he’d be well advised to take advantage of what’s on offer for free by a bunch of bright people.
And if he doesn’t have ’em, I’d like to think he’s prepared to demand that the case be thrown out due to evidence tampering!
I don’t disagree about Waltherppk, I am thinking that they are not able to release them because of Judge Lester’s order, that is still in effect.
You may well have a point there, bori, but I do wish that the GZ legal team would make **some** comment on the subject, knowing how critically important these logs could be. Even if they only said that they had the logs but couldn’t release them or publicly discuss them yet, at least we’d know that the ping logs hadn’t gone down the same rabbit hole as that 8-page report on TM.
I have ask MOM but he said he could not comment. Make with that what you will. I wish he would have said more but that is all I got.
The recent CTH FOIA revelations throw a monkey wrench into matters, in as much as, the 8 page report sent to SPD on TM disappeared. This is they type of material that should have been handed over to the defense during discovery. It would have allowed for a more pointed questioning of SPD personnel, especially Serino. You may yet see a motion from MOM/West tied to this material if they never received it.
You made me think of how during the interview with George, I believe it was Serino that said to him that they did a check on Trayvon and he came up clean. It’s hard for me to believe that surrounding departments don’t know what is going on at other departments and police attached to schools. If they rely on other departments to provide them with (cough) accurate intel you would think they already knew that a political agenda was going on in Miami-Dade to cover up crimes by students and they may not want to speak to quickly on whether Trayvon was squeaky clean or not. It’s their business to understand what other departments are doing and how it will effect intel should they need it for crimes commmitted in their neck of the woods. It’s a network folks. I wonder how much of that same sort of thing goes on in Sanford too. And police are worse than a bunch of ole ladies at a sewing circle when it comes to “what other departments are doing”. Hey, did you hear that over in Miama-Dade they’ve got 60% decrease in crime at the schools? Sanford knew.
I’m wondering if the info may have been included in Wolfinger’s file that MOM has been trying to get. IIRC he said in one of the hearings that he had NOT received the ENTIRE file that was given to the SAO when Corey was appointed.
I’m also wondering if the pics or info on the stolen jewelry was ever used to see if any matched with the jewelry stolen from Twin Lakes in the weeks prior to the shooting…..hmmmm???
From the documents the jewelry was stored, after the IA investigation started is when the jewelry was investigated, don’t know if anything was found out about it.
“From the documents the jewelry was stored, after the IA investigation started is when the jewelry was investigated, don’t know if anything was found out about it.”
As I understand it, Metro Dade found out about the jewelry when Robles’s article ran, and that’s when they asked the school cops for it, which is when it was brought out of storage and was going to be photographed before being turned over, until that Lt. came in the room and put the kibosh on the transfer.
Supposedly that bringing it out of storage was part of the “unauthorized access to Martin’s records” that someone supposedly reported which led to the charges and Internal Affairs investigation.
Of course that doesn’t prove that the charges and IA investigation weren’t really designed to find out who leaked to Robles.
That brings up an interesting point.
If the jewelry was deliberately mis-labeled as “found property”, the group of people who could have known about it’s alleged connection to Martin, one of which would have to be Robles’s source, can’t be comprised of very many individuals.
And now I’ve forgotten where in that timeline the sending of the 8 pages to the Sanford PD occurred.
Thanks, you are right about the IA starting after the release of information to Robles, but the jewelry was tied to TM by a number without a description if I remember correctly.
Sure hope you’re right, hooson. BTW, I gotta say you’re a class act. No matter what’s thrown at you on various sites where I’ve seen you post, you remain immaculately courteous. In fact, you raise Internet courtesy to an art form, and even when I don’t agree with you, I have to admire your style.
Totally agree, +1000
given that this thread is for all kinds of extraneous information, let me just say that all of our hearts go out to the victims of Boston bombing. these kind of tragic events give us pause to consider whether or not the ridiculous things we sometimes argue are really worthwhile in the big scheme of things. it is during these times of struggle that we, as Americans, come together to be the best we can be–to realize that we have a great nation here that we are able to voice our opinions, even if they are sometimes ridiculous. that, even when we disagree amongst ourselves, we are still united in a way that is hard to understand for outsiders. debate is healthy and we are all entitled to our opinion. but in the end, we surely are going to have to come together like we did in WWII and after 9/11 in order to secure the ideals to which we all aspire–freedom in this great republic of the USA!
Nettles? If I send you a message at your facebook page, are you the only one that sees it? I thought I read something about you have admins over there. That’s why I ask.
I don’t have a facebook page. I comment on one about the case. You can inbox me through facebook. I use my real profile, Annette Elaine Kelly or you can email me at email@example.com Both are secure.
Just in case anyone has created fake accounts with my name, here is the legitmate url address on facebook to inbox me. https://www.facebook.com/annette.e.kelly
I sent you an email. Did you see it?
Yes I got it. I sent a reply.
(if this link has been shared, I apologize.)
Fired Florida officer defends use of ‘Trayvon Martin’ targets!
Two gems I had to share…..fist is from Nat Jackson’s buddy frances robles ….the irony is rich
Reporters, everyone, repeat after me: “I will not tweet (or even retweet) something if I do not know for certain whether it is true.” coreshift@coreshift19m
I wonder if Sybrina is going to try & get compensation from the #BostonMarathon victim compensation fund. I mean it’s about #Trayvon right?
She did say “reporters” so it does not apply to her.
new leathercult fantasy….abc digitally alterd bloody gz photo to help hide GZ guilt http://whonoze.wordpress.com/2013/04/17/abchead/
How do you spell d.e.s.p.e.ra.t.i.o.n. combined with too much time on their hands.
Now GZ showed up to attack trevon with pre-existing injuries and Trevon had no idea how to fight! DERP!!!!!
Benjamin “Justice 4 Trayvon” Crump In all honesty, even though Trayvon had a right to defend himself, the kid never did, nor did he even know how to fight. There was zero dna transfer on the kid’s hands, arms, sleeves, and cuffs. Fogen staged those injuries to try and bolster a self defense claim. He either did it then and there, or he showed up to the crime scene with pre made injuries.
Like · 6 · Sunday at 01:06
Do they read what they write, how stupid much you be to put that on the internet for eternity. I have nothing against people who are ignorant, but pretending to be smart and then say such stupidity, really takes the cake.
BOYS IN THE HOODIES
POLICE BURIED TRAYVON’S CRIMINAL HISTORY
EXCLUSIVE: Jack Cashill exposes fact ‘good kid’ Martin should have been arrested twice
New witness list was submitted by the defense yesterday.
let me try 😉 http://www.flcourts18.org/PDF/Press_Releases/Defendant's%202nd%20Supplemental%20Witness%20List%20(Redacted).pdf
Looks like you have to add the pdf manually ;(
Notice of Hearing was also posted yesterday giving the agenda for the next court appearance on April 30th.
Nettles- It appears that the agenda for the next hearing is what O’Mara wants to address before the judge, but, it will be interesting to see if Nelson does in fact address, or rule on those items. She is more worried about trial seating after all. I keep remembering that the hearing date is just two days after the state’s deadline to respond to the 5th DCA, and the defense will be within their 10 day reply period. I wonder if Nelson will walk on eggshells, or defiantly continue to be biased for the state.
Since Crump has been corresponding with the court on the confidentiality agreement status, I wonder if he will show up to argue, or if he will send his moose on a rampage to argue on his behalf.
I get the impression that Judge Nelson was ticked with the defense. Perhaps it was the motions to sanction the State that set her off. She, for reasons still unknown, canceled the scheduled hearing of April 2nd without consulting with the defense. Even so, the defense did hope to get an earlier date to hear the outstanding motions before the court http://www.gzlegalcase.com/index.php/press-releases/131-regarding-the-next-hearing-date-in-the-zimmerman-case she obviously doesn’t care and the next one is still scheduled for April 30th. Since then, the defense has written the Writ to overturn two of her former decisions, not to depose Crump. Her second denial gave me the impression again she was upset with the defense by not telling them why or giving them the benefit of a hearing before dismissing their motion.
I predict Judge Nelson to once again walk into her courtroom with her mind already made up. If they want to get her to consider anything before court, they better put it in a motion.
My hope now for George Zimmerman lies with the appeals court.
I’m looking over the documents filed and I do not see a REPLY by the defense re: both of the Motions for Sanctions. I would think they should reply … no? Defense made a write up in the Press Release section, but from what I see there is no Reply.
Good point. I assume the Judge doesn’t read their website. 🙂
Defense should Reply. You want to get the last word in.
Ha !! I knew their not replying was strange. Now we see that not only did they REPLY but they moved to STRIKE the response of the State. The only thing more I would have liked to have seen in this Reply is that they should have done a listing of how the State failed to respond to this and this and this and so on and so on to drive home that besides the personal attacks they did an epic fail in responding to ANY of the contents of the Motion. Pound on that sob.
That has been her m.o. up until now. It will likely continue.
Interesting to note, the witness list was made up and signed a week ago but just submitted yesterday (which was the deadline).
Here is Rene Stutzman write-up on the witness list and the expectations of the next court date.
Defense’s response to Mr. Crump to keep settlement confidential.
Good rebuttal from MOM, very little law but Crump’s request also had little law attached to it, it was mostly distraction, and diversion. The point about the Confidentiality agreement is point on, but there are laws that applies, I hope the Judge does consider it, though.
Yes, bori, I thought it was a very good rebuttal, not least because it’s rich with sub-text. Para.9 is particularly enjoyable when discussing whether TrayDad changed his story (about whose voice was screaming for help) not b/c Crump introduced him to the smell of lawsuit $$ but b/c he allegedly heard a cleaned-up version of the NEN tape. “The Defense is unaware of any improvement in the quality of the recording, and if there was an improved recording, one would think Mr. Crump would have disclosed it.” Yeah, ‘cos we all know how great he is at producing crystal-clear recordings and handing them over to the defense promptly. Uh-huh.
Great point about the recordings if they were the same quality as the FBI, co-produced tapes of DeeDee then it could have been anyone.
I’d love to see the defense file a motion for Crump to produce the “cleaned-up recording. Then let Crump and/or the state have to admit that there are no other NEN recordings. Make Crump admit he lied yet again.
I love the way you think, minpin! 😀
Landau- I got my wish today. They asked for the non-existent cleaned up recording. Yipeeee. Make them admit it was yet another lie on Crump’s part. Now I would like to see the defense file a motion for discovery for the “previous recording” the state referred to in the reply to the Writ filed with the 5th DCA. They had in a footnote that Crump was simply asking W8 to repeat what she had said in a previous recording, when Crump claimed he was not talking during the silences. Where is that previous recording that may also not exist. Make them admit their lies.
The screams were in the 911 calls, not on the NEN call. The 911 tapes that Tracey listened to were Serino’s from the 911 center, so they didn’t need cleaning up.
Let’s try it this way:
DEFENDANT’S RESPONSE TO MOTION TO DETERMINE CONFIDENTIALITY OF COURT RECORDS IN OPPOSITION TO DEFENDANT’S MOTION TO UNSEAL
4/17/13 Notice of Hearing April 30, 9:00 AM
4/17/13 Defendant’s 2nd Supplemental Witness List (Redacted)
4/16/13 Original Copy of Correspondence from Benjamin Crump
04/17/2013 DNP DEFENDANT WAS NOT PRESENT FOR DOCKET SOUNDING
04/17/2013 MNF MINUTES FOR DOCKET SOUNDING BEFORE JUDGE MARLENE M ALVA
04/17/2013 MNFD COURT GRANTED JOINT MOTION TO CONTINUE
04/17/2013 MNFD STATE ATTORNEY JOHN GUY WAS PRESENT FOR DOCKET SOUNDING
04/17/2013 MNFD DEFENSE ATTORNEY SIMS, KELLY B WAS PRESENT FOR DOCKET SOUNDING
04/17/2013 PRNO NOTICE TO ALL PARTIES
04/17/2013 MNFD WAIVER OF APPEARANCE PREVIOUSLY FILED
04/17/2013 DKSN DOCKET SOUNDING CONTINUED TO 07/10/2013 AT 0900AM IN COURTROOM 5C, AT CRIMINAL
04/17/2013 DKSN –JUSTICE BUILDING BEFORE JUDGE MARLENE M ALVA
04/17/2013 MNFD (1)PERJURY IN OFFICIAL PROCEEDINGS 837.02 F-3: DEFENDANT CONTINUED ON BOND
04/16/2013 MOTN EXECUTIVE ORDER NUMBER 12-279
04/16/2013 MOTN MOTION TO DISMISS OR IN THE ALTERNATIVE PETITION FOR WRIT OF OUO WARRANTO RE:
Thank you! I would add the new witness list to Mr. O’Mara’s section.
Never mind, I see it’s in the court section 🙂
WHAT THE HELL?
Not Sybrina’s account, just some idiot trying to rile people up. We don’t need this, we have the law and facts on our side.
I saw that it was fake, forgot I also had posted here. Sorry Dman will you delete, THIS IS A FAKE TWITTER. Sorry again
My that account was suspended quickly, I wonder how many fake George accounts got that same treatment, I’m guessing not many.
MIT shoot out caught on video…..insane! https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=wSlRHJv1nnA
sudden death is way to good for them.
Good one! Then ask why he was hiding it.
Since the State has added RZ Jr., SZ, & Mom Z to their witness list, what does the State expect to garner from their testimony? Will Shellie be ask about being charged with perjury? SZ doesn’t have to testify against GZ, will she be asked about the gun permits, etc., since she has a gun permit too?
The defense should add Lester, Corey, Scott, Obama, and Sharpton.
Diane Tennis, legal analyst for FOX Orlando was interviewed on the witness list:
Shellie can not testify. H&W privilege and her pending case. This SA seems over the edge here. Holy Mackerel! Is he trying to get sanctioned?
Barry will be on a golfing vacation.
George Zimmerman/Trayvon Martin Discussion #5
I’m hoping that Bondi or de la Rionda have this same experience….
http://ww2.cox.com/myconnection/sandieg … =DA5OQBU00
Ex-Texas DA faces criminal charges in case that convicted innocent man of wife’s killing
04-19-2013 01:15 PM PDT |By MICHAEL BRICK, Associated Press
GEORGETOWN, Texas (Associated Press) —
A former district attorney acted improperly when he prosecuted an innocent man who spent nearly 25 years in prison, a Texas judge ruled Friday as he ordered the former prosecutor’s arrest on criminal contempt and tampering charges.
“Mr. Anderson consciously chose to conceal the availability of the exculpatory evidence so he could convict Mr. Morton for murder,” Sturns said. “This court cannot think of a more intrinsically harmful act than a prosecutor’s intentional choice to hide evidence so as to convict a defendant facing a murder charge and a life sentence.”
Morton, 58, was released from prison in October 2011 after new DNA tests showed he did not fatally beat his wife, Christine, in their north Austin home in 1986. Another man has been arrested for the killing. Anderson, who has been a judge in Williamson County since 2002, has apologized to Morton for what he called failures in the system but said he believes there was no misconduct in the case.
Among the evidence Morton’s attorneys claim was kept from them were statements from Morton’s then-3-year-old son, who witnessed the murder and said his father wasn’t responsible and interviews with neighbors who told authorities they saw a man park a green van close the Morton home and walk into a nearby wooded area before the slaying.
The new DNA tests, which were conducted on a bloody bandanna found near the Mortons’ home, pointed to another suspect, Mark Alan Norwood, who was arrested for the killing in November 2011 and found guilty of murder. Norwood also has been indicted in the 1988 slaying of an Austin woman who lived near the Mortons.
Anderson also is being sued by the State Bar of Texas for his conduct in the Morton case.
I read that and see that prosecutors have long enjoyed the freedom to do as they please with immunity. Twenty five years is a long time; Anderson even became a judge. I’m sure it took quite a long time and a lot of effort by someone to even get the DNA tests done. Had someone not fought hard for this, Anderson would still be sitting behind the bench and Morton would still be in prison. This is what angers and frightens me the most! Nothing Anderson did is any worse than what the Zimmerman persecution has done and continues to do, yet no one is being held accountable in Florida.
Anyone here find this as interesting as I did? http://cops.heraldtribune.com/Officer/Details/126286 “Failure to qualify with a firearm”
What the heck?
Ohhhhh the irony is killing me in this comment by Al “race pimp” Sharpton:T]he false reporting by the media in the Boston bombing case was offensive and inflammatory, including specific references by CNN’s John King who labeled the alleged suspect as a “dark-skinned male,” perpetuating a stereotypical characterization devoid of relevant facts about the suspect’s identity.
It was irresponsible and misleading to characterize the suspect by his race and it made every dark skinned male in Boston a suspect. If I reported that a “white-skinned male” was being sought after, I would be publicly maligned as a “racial agitator.” The media must be responsible and put facts in proper context.
well the brothers were as Caucasian as you can get.
In Russia, the Caucasians are considered “darkies”.
Russia tried to warn USA about this dangerous Caucasian.
George Zimmerman a no good jew? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=17ElysqF1qg
Nasty Nat alleges Zimmerman told police Trevon dragged him out of his truck and beat him http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VMWHjx20c3w
Natalie jackson interview making sure everyone knows Dee Dee had to go to the hospital http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bR_I1soXYeo
Angela Corey evades every direct question http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CSgLKwfnBaE
Is this the latest thread?
Frederica Wilson tells congress tampon screamed for his life as he ran away from Zimmerman (while magically walking fast talking to dee dee on the phone) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LgOS7f1ZxHI
That fat cowboy hat cunt should have to be accountable for her comments but, since she’s a black democrat, not likely. Are they EVER held accountable or parodied nationally like Condi “Aunt Tom” Rice and Herman “Rapey” Cain?
Speaking of accountabilty, I personally think that word is more objectionable than the “n word”, and totally unnecessary.
I’m completely in agreement, lorac. Stupid, loathsome and rabidly racist tho pink cowboy hat creature undoubtedly is, there’s no need for us to sink into the slime with her.
I, also, completely agree with lorac and LMF.
Utterly gratuitous especially because that portion of her anatomy is now never utilized.
I don’t know whether to be curious as to how you could possibly know that for certain or afraid that you might actually tell us how you could possibly know that for certain.
When do we expect to hear from the appeals court ?
hey jordan2222 – the State has to send their response, THEN, MOM/West have 10 days to respond to the State response, it seems the Defense will have the last word,, MOM/West will have the last word on the arguments.
yes, this is the latest thread for general discussion on GZ’s case..
Leatherturd is defending the bombers. No wonder the cultist worship this moron! http://frederickleatherman.com/2013/04/21/dzhokhar-tsarnaev-should-be-mirandized/
captainlongschlongsilver – That really disturbs me that Leatherman is defending the bombers, but it is in line w/his distorted view of reality and facts. I was shocked to read the mom had been arrested for trying to steal $ 1,700.00 worth of clothes from Lord & Taylor, the older brother had been arrested, WHY WEREN’T the trio deported? WHY have laws that aren’t enforced?
I also read the father is “crazy” and everyone who knows the family is aware of it. Nice little group of folks. So glad we could offer them refuge.
I’ve heard people speak of Leatherman before, but I never went to the site.
I went back and read some of the Zimmerman posts. Those people are CRAZY! I’ve never heard so many ridiculous conspiracy theories in my llfe.
1) Multiple people were involved in a conspiracy to kill Trayvon
2) GZ’s motive was because he wanted to set up an assassin for hire company
3) DeeDee is in mortal danger from “rightwing” wackos. (I have heard plenty of ridicule and skepticism, but never heard anything remotely that can be considered a threat against DeeDee)
4) Rightwingers will hold huge destructive riots after GZ is convicted. The government is aware of this and taking precaution.
jack203 – I tried reading there ne time and when leatherman stated in a comment: “anyone that believes GZ is a RACIST” I left & never read there again. IF you read blog comments at the OS and some of the other newspapers, TM supporters consistently call those supporting GZ’s right to a fair trial “RACIST.” Apparently some that are unable to think independently or understand discovery get their “talking points” from leatherman.
I don’t see him defending the bombers, but rather defending the rights of the accused; something everyone should be doing. There is a certain sense of irony abound in which those tragically against GZ are arguing for the rights of the bombers, and those adamantly defending the rights of George are vehemently against the rights of Tsarnaev.
And that is exactly my point DangerMauz….Leatherhead is a huge advocate for violating GZ’s constitutional rights but the bombers rights must be preserved at all costs
Fair enough. Don’t get me wrong, he’s as daft as they come.
Leatherturd now accuses police of murdering boston bomber http://frederickleatherman.com/2013/04/22/who-killed-tamerlan-tsarnaev/
Excellent commentary by Alan Der. imo, he basically said what Jeralyn said yesterday in an article, she too sited another case in which Miranda was delayed to get information. Boston is where Alan Dershowitz practices law, teaches at Harvard and lives there and reminds us the Court is stickler there on the rules of law and the defendants rights.. It’s a shame the opportunity of the death penalty may be lost..
Jeralyn’s article today:
Boston Bombing Suspect Charged and Advised, Counsel Appointed!
Now that they are pursuing the case in Federal Courts, AD might have a point. By trying to appease one group and not declaring him an enemy combatant right away, they could have blown the case. I guess we will have to wait a couple of years to find out for sure.
I read earlier today he had been advised of his Miranda rights. Is that correct?
The bigboi cult is now comparing the Zimmerman brothers to the boston bombers http://imgur.com/UBWTK0Y
UUUGGHHHHH…….That is wrong on SOOOOO many levels!! These people truly frighten me….this goes WAY beyond CRAZY!!
Is no news good news for George? I have not read anything recently. Has anyone else?
jordan2222 – I haven’t read anything new since Mrs. Zimmerman’s letter about how the Justice system failed them. Then of course the response from Sybrina/Tracy which was insulting. I think the revised witness list was released by MOM.
I think the next Court date is April 29th, surely there will some new articles before then.
I believe that it’s the 30th of April for hearing. April 28th is the deadline for response to the Writ for Appeal.
Thank you. I missed the response from Sybrina/Tracy but I did read Mrs. Z’s letter.
jordan2222 – you didn’t miss anything in the response by Sybrina/Tracy to Mrs. Z., it was simply more propaganda, misrepresentation, and all the usual lies they have spewed since the case began.
Click Orlando added info on the key players but did a minimal job imo, most bloggers could have written a more accurae article, it isn’t anything new BUT the comments are interesting especially on Tracy.
Key Players: Trayvon Martin article:
Key Players: George Zimmerman article
Key Players: Bernie de la Rionda article
Key Players: Mark O’Mara article
Key Players: Judge Debra S. Nelson article
Key Players: Tracy Martin article
Key Players: Sybrina Fulton article.
The Traybots are spinning away on my video of Trevons record:
Approval required for comment on Trayvon Martin’s Hidden Criminal Record
Too funny! If it’s not a joke, you are suffering some serious delusion. I read all this stuff when Sundance first posted it. There is NOthing in there showing ANY criminal activity from TM. NOthing. Even Sundance himself admits that. Having “run ins” with school police doesn’t make you a criminal. There’s not a shred of evidence TM ever attacked anyone, had a fight, or even said a harsh word to ANYone. Videos like this one just show how desperate GZ’s supporters are. You’re proving his guilt.
Another Traynut commenting on my video that CNN changed the word coon into the word cold :
lonniedobbins has made a comment on Zimmerman NEN Call Enhanced: No Racial Slur
This comment requires your approval. You can approve or reject it by visiting the comments page.
Then why did he say he said punks? This man morphed the word to cold. You could hear the morph.
When the City of Sanford had the NEN call up on their website I listened and each time I heard “cold” or “cone(s)” or “coat(s), or something like that.
As for what was really said, or to what it referred, I have no idea, but every time I’ve listened, there and Wikipedia and a couple of other places, that’s what I’ve heard, a “k”, followed by an “oh”
That doesn’t mean I’m right, but what I heard on the Sanford site is what I’ve heard since then in other places.
captainlongschlongsilver – I read at CBS that John King, CNN, issued an “APOLOGY” for his inaccurate reporting of the bombing suspects, but he apologized for saying an “arrest is imminent,” I guess he had TOO MUCH to apologize for, but he did say he “was embarrassed.” This type of RUSH to be the first to report is outrageous, it doesn’t even have to be accurate & has done immeasurable damage to GZ. There is no unringing the bell in SOME nitwit minds, they convicted GZ and that hasn’t changed.
Hopefully this will start a trend, so reporters are more responsible in their reporting. GZ suffered tremendously because of the bad early reporting so it is too late for him.
boricuafudd – although John King apologized, imo, he should have been fired setting a real example. ITS the RATINGS they are cutting each other’s throats for & trying to be the 1st to report a breaking fact, but in this case, CNN was the 1st t report wrong information. CNN is last in the ratings for a reason & they have taken some action, Zucker, that once ran NBC is now at the helm of CNN, he’s done a lot of house cleaning INCLUDING Soledad O’Brien whom I couldn’t stand because she was so liberal she couldn’t report the facts correctly in a story, but John King should go imo, he continues to be what’s wrong with CNN.
You are right about GZ, I don’t know if even acquitted, he can repair the damage done to his life by the USUAL SUSPECTS. But! He can hopefully sue the hell out of them!
I agree a better example would have been to just fire the guy, but as the saying goes beggars can’t be choosers, the fact that he made a public apology is a start. I waiting for Gutman’s apology to GZ, hopefully as part of a large settlement in GZ’s favor.
As for Zucker, I don’t know how much different it will be, remember Tom Brokaw worked under him and he was blaming America for turning the bombing suspect into a terrorist.
boricuafudd – you are right about T Brokaw. I had to laugh, a friend & I keep an ever growing list of those stars we are burnt out on, those that have gotten older & become so wealthy from media/TV/movies & think their opinion MEANS a rats ass to anyone on gun control, prayer in school, etc. The elite group can impose their opinions & philosophies on us because they can, most are not educated and can’t even address the violence in rap or movies and DON’T WANT to. My list includes Brokaw who needs to go home and get off TV & out of our faces, taking along Oprah, Cher, Joan Rivers whose nasty attacks on younger artist are embarrassing, tasteless, & mean spirited. Mick Jaggar, Matt Lauer but at 23 million a year, I guess he will stay until they won’t pay him anymore & let’s not forget the trashy Kardashin’s, Lindsey Lohan & her nut job dad Micheal.
Meanwhile, ANY of those that bilked the limelight CAN do something really heroic & DONATE money or their time to raising awareness on missing/murdered or forgotten/abused children, but then, those children aren’t sought after by the Media.
You forgot big mouthed NUT(job) farmer Roseann.
…and Spike Lee and Michael Tyson
Has anyone read anything on the GZ Legal Defense Fund lately? The last I read, last week, the media said they were down to $ 2,000.00. I guess MOM is going to need to appeal to the public again for funds, there is still a long way to go before this nightmare ends for GZ. Of course, I guess “indigency” is still an option.
I too wonder how long voir dire might take, with 6 chosen jurors, but 500 potential jurors, it may take awhile.
Thanks a lot for all of the links. Who is Craig Miller? He seems up to date on the case.
I was hoping the NRA might step to the plate. Maybe Beasley will help out.
jordan2222 – that Fla. has some gun toting people with “concealed permits,” over a million at last count. I too read the numbers have gone up since Obama was working on gun control, that figure DOESN’T INCLUDE those that OWN one or more guns in the State of Fla. I never thought about the NRA donating to the defense fund, but since GZ’s gun was used to defend himself, maybe they should consider it.
I guess Tracy/Sybrina are off spending their money, buying new cars, etc., I am glad they have finally shut up, the Anthony’s did the same thing after their last BIG pay day from Dr. Phil for $ 600,000, they ANT’s ask for their privacy after they bilked the National MEDIA imo, for close to a million dollars, for licensing fees of course. LOL! Sybrina/Tracy don’t want to answer questions as to WHAT they are going to do withy the money, I can only imagine. I hope Tracy considers a vasectomy with some of his money, he has countless kids born in our out of wedlock w/different baby mamas, and a NEW baby born to Brandi in Jan. 2013. It’s really sad, at least ALL Tracy’s kids are going to have their child support paid. imho. Maybe he too will consider supervising his kids instead of leaving them unattended now that he has probably retired.
Gotta give it to ya Art Tart, when there is nothing else to talk about with the George Zimmerman case. you do find a way to bring the tabloid news into the discussion. Every last little bit of it.
Just curious art trat. are you ever speechless about anything?
And as I recall from your CTH days, minpin06, when things are slow — and even when they aren’t — you have a habit of slamming other commenters. Why is that? Why don’t you simply skip and scroll past comments you don’t care to read?
minipin06 – does that bother you? If it does, scroll and roll, things have been slow in the GZ case. This thread has encompassed several topics including the Boston bombings, CNN, media reporting, etc. I read 4 or 5 different papers a day, I am interested in a wide variety of topics as well as high profile cases and follow several missing children. No, I am not speechless about many things NOR am I intense or critical of others.
Trayvon’s aunt Ebony says TM lived with her during a radio interview http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NMc-njHsAC4
Florida is among many states that follows common law regarding citizen’s arrest. You can detain someone, until police arrive, if you witness a felony or have reasonable belief someone committed a felony. You should tell a person if they are under arrest, but don’t worry about reading them Miranda rights. http://articles.sun-sentinel.com/2012-02-14/news/fl-florida-citizens-arrest-20120207_1_false-arrest-drunken-driver-hit-and-run-driver
“… if you witness a felony or have reasonable belief someone committed a felony. ”
Interesting, but how does that figure into the Martin/Zimmerman case?
State wants answer from George Zimmerman on ‘stand your ground’ hearing
Prosecutor asks judge to conduct “full inquiry” of Trayvon Martin’s shooter.
And the actual motion is available on GZ Legal Case. Not ONE SINGLE citation to case law in Bernie’s motion, NONE. He simply wants to force the issue, without any precedent, in an attempt to preclude any post trial motions for immunity.
So the state claims that crump’s info is priviileged work product but now it is trying to get jn to force MOM to reveal defense strategy? Bdlr is totally clueless!
Obviously MOM is smart enuf to know if he is waiving syg. He cannot be forced to reveal anything regarding his trial strategy. His response to crazy bernie should provide a few laughs!
This irritates me beyond belief. The State continues to act like Zimmerman has to “prove his innocence”.
No – THEY have to prove his guilt on Murder 2, “beyond a reasonable doubt”.
And they’re being allowed to get away with this game in the mainstream media.
Only if he presents an “affirmative” defense. ( self-defense) He can sit there like a potted plant and let the state try to prove his guilt beyond a reasonable doubt. That is what the SA is worried about. The defense is going to have a lot of the states so called evidence suppressed. What will the SA be left with? Police taking the 5th? Other state witnesses taking the 5th? They have no case. This is a defense lawyers dream. I just hope the DCA puts an end to this nonsense. Deposing Crump will bring the house of cards tumbling down. IMO.
I need eye bleach due to the visual!!! ROFLMBO~
Zumbathon for Justice 4.28.13 – #TrayvonMartin Laurel Boys & Girls Club $10 Donation 701 Montgomery St., Laurel MD 3-5p.m. @Mommies_NMotion
— Benjamin Crump, Esq. (@attorneycrump) April 24, 2013
Zumbathon for Justice 4.28.13 – #TrayvonMartin Laurel Boys & Girls Club $10 Donation 701 Montgomery St., Laurel MD 3-5p.m. @Mommies_NMotion
— Benjamin Crump, Esq. (@attorneycrump) April 24, 2013
I’m surprised it’s not a Twerk-a-thon. 😆
THERE’S AS “WHOLE LOTTA SHAKIN’ GOIN’ ON!”
The State’s response to the Writ has been filed.
Anybody notice on page 40 that Crump is referred to as Mr. Trump. I bet the Donald would love that!
Yes , I noticed that too. A Freudian slip, Crump aspires to be Trump.
Is this response written by Pam Bondi?
No the same person who wrote the response to recuse Judge Lester, Pamela J. Koller wrote it.
How about this. Yes and no. It is the office of Bondi so in effect it is her responding as it is her office though her assistant is listed as the one on the paper. Who knows who actually wrote what, had input as to what should or should not be included, how to word various things, etc.
Isn’t Koller supposed to be the appellate expert from the state? I thought I read that somewhere. Actually I think they were given “guidance” by the DOJ. The response is filled with 41 pages worth of blah blah blah, and blah blah blah, and in case you missed the first blah blah blah, here is some more. The argument is about as good as the argument was when they backed Judge Fester, ooops, meant Lester. I await the defense response, they were given a gift by the state that has proven that all they have is GZ profiled TM, he was told not to follow him but he did anyway, he confronted TM, with no proof of that at all, and that GZ in fact did have a gun in his holster when the police arrived. They keep showing over and over again, that they have nothing, nothing, and less than nothing. Gilbreath was a gift early on.
I don’t know but yes it would be good to look more into her though before forming a more solid opinion and really it’s not like I have experience in such offices to really know anyway. But if it’s a question of who actually wrote it I would find it doubtful that Koller sat down one day and wrote the whole thing by her lonesome self and regardless it still comes down to Bondi’s office. It’s funny you mention Gilbreath though because I was going to bring him up and the probable cause affidavit as an example as well. It’s his name along with O’Steen that signed off on it but apparently per Gilbreaths testimony it was a group effort to write it including him not knowing who included certain aspects written into it, some investigator huh? Doesn’t even know who wrote what into a serious document such as that which he was a part of writing and signed, pfft. I could imagine it being the same with any office including O’Mara’s, I doubt his motions are entirely constructed by him and it’s ultimately him, as well with Corey with the Gilbreath example, Koller with Bondi, who are responsible for what comes out of that office, it’s their name on the door no matter who works there.
The State has the public and institutionalized white guilt and they will win on that.
This piece of work is as bad as the response to 86’ing Lester.
They also call him Mr. Crumb in parts. 🙂
I missedd that nettles- maybe because he is such a crumb. ( I can think of more appropriate names but don’t want to get banned 😆
You don’t think Ms. Bondi was trying to distance herself from the comment she made on Piers Morgan on March 27th, that she is friends with Mr. Crump? You don’t think she will point to this example and say see at times I couldn’t remember his name in writing the response. 😉
“Hey Sybrina, Tracy, are you there? Hi. I am so very, very, sorry. As attorney general, I have absolutely no legal authority to take the case, and I looked, I tried.” Looks like she gets to after all, in a way anyway. Of course I also believe in Bondi’s efforts to help Crump et al. she “helped” Wolfinger with “his” decision to remove himself but that’s just my own little “conspiracy theory”. So yeah, she tries alright, white guilt ridden coward that she is.
Re: in back of limo on speakerphone with Florida AG
Is there a transcript of that somewhere, including what was said after the video cuts off?
I’m assuming Bondi went on to explain a little better than that.
In the state’s response, in the footnote on page 39, where they are addressing the gaps in the tape from Crump, they note-
“According to the recording provided by petitioner, it appears that Mr. Crump was simply asking Witness 8 to ‘repeat her previously recorded’ testimony.”
Is anyone aware of any other previously recoded testimony by Witness 8 before Crump’s recording? I know Crump said something to DD about repeating what she had told Mr. Tracy and Ms. Sybrina. Did the Martin parents get some kind of recording from DD even before DD did the interview with Crump? Is there another recording out there that no one is aware of, and that has never been disclosed? The state admits that no one knew about5 DD for several weeks, but no one is still willing to come forward with how DD was found. If I am not mistaken, the defense has stated that they can get no answers from the state, or from Crump apparently, on exactly how DD came to be an ear witness.
I’m not a lawyer but, it appears the state is lecturing the Appelate Court on why and how they had no basis to take up and accept the Writ. They claim that GZ could have a whole new trial if it is ever proven that he was harmed by the lack of disclosure of evidence. It seems that they are arguing that the appelate court is wasting time and money on even hearing this Writ, and that it is just clogging the court system, yet they suggest that a whole new trial could be had if it doesn’t work out right for the defense. That is outreageous, and contradictory.
‘ “According to the recording provided by petitioner, it appears that Mr. Crump was simply asking Witness 8 to ‘repeat her previously recorded’ testimony.” ‘
Maybe they mean previously recorded by ABC while Crump sat there not noticing that his recorder wasn’t recording.
“… but no one is still willing to come forward with how DD was found. If I am not mistaken, the defense has stated that they can get no answers from the state, or from Crump apparently, on exactly how DD came to be an ear witness.”
Let’s see, didn’t Jackson say it was their investigator that found her?
Didn’t Crump say Tracy Martin discovered her?
Doesn’t the state in this reply refer to Crump saying that he found her?
That’s 3 different versions right there, and that’s before we hear the state’s version of how they found out who she was after Crump revealed that she existed.
DD told OMara in her deposition that Crump was the first person to contact her from the Martins.
When did they reveal any of what W8 said in her deposition by the defense?
MOM included in the info in the motion to reconsider the deposition of Crump.
I do not maintain files, Nettles or Dman has it.
I’ve got your back! “Mr. Crump is the first person the Petitioner knew for sure was told this information” (in reference to DD being in hospital) Page 33/43 of the Writ. http://www.gzdocs.com/documents/0413/petition.pdf
That’s two different questions.
Crump may be the first person to learn about the hospitalization (or more accurately the first person to be lied to about it), and one wonders how he knew to ask about it (since lawyers aren’t supposed to ask questions to which they don’t already know the answer).
But Cassandra said Witness 8 said that Crump was the first person to contact her about the case and that her statement to that effect was made in O’Mara’s deposition of her.
The petition PDF only mentions that the defense conducted a partial deposition of Witness 8, but reveals nothing of what she said.
I was wondering how any of what she said in that partial deposition became “free range”.
At the top of page 34 of the Writ, we learn that Mr. Crump was the first person to interact with Witness 8. Not Tracy, not Sybrina. Nope, Mr. Crump was the first to talk with her.
That information must have come from W8’s deposition. The defense wants to despose Crump and find out how he was able to be the first one to interact with her. It’s also evidence that the interview isn’t the first time he talked to her.
Assuming O’Mara isn’t using some restrictive definition of “interact” where Tracy calling and asking if he can have Crump get in touch doesn’t make the cut but Crump actually conducting the interview does, then I can see where it would be a logical assumption that the Witness 8 deposition was O’Mara’s source for this claim, but Cassandra just saying it flat out without either of the words “assume” or “infer” anywhere in sight made it appear that perhaps some or all of the text of the deposition transcript had been made public, and I didn’t remember hearing anything about that happening, and would expect that I would have as people screamed about her security being compromised.
Looks to me like she says. This is awful. This is a railroad job. Terrible. But not quite bad enough for the higher court to step in. It is OK to frame this guy and ruin his and his family’s life. Just let it continue. Let the trial court continue to destroy innocent citizens. We can always spend a few years unraveling this mess while the Zimmerman’s rot in jail. Amazing.
Righto. It is all they have. You got it. The response is that this is bad but not bad enough for a writ of certiorari. I think people should research what it is. A rare writ to stop a railroad train. It is about a runaway trial court with no regard for due process. I thinks the ruling will tell how high this reaches. Trial Courts are sposed to be unbiased seekers of truth first. Here one TCJ was already sent packing for being biased. Next?
If I’m not mistaken she’s trying to excuse and minimize the 5 minute ABC clip 1..2..3..Go, lol.
“It appears” is a very passive voice. Any 1st year law student knows that is a no-no. In a brief you mast use active voice or be thrown in the trash can. This is pathetic.
By citing Crumo asking DD to repeat her previously recorded testimony, hasn’t the state yet brought up another rabbit hole that the defense would have to chase down? Can’t the defense come back and say what previously recorded testimony is the state referring to?
Not being a lawyer, can someone please explain what the term “testimony” means? Do the statements of witnesses have to be under oath, or are just any statements anyone makes considered testimony?
My prediction for what it’s worth. The DCA will rule that Crump can be deposed. If they rule against the defense, then it will set a precedent that in any criminal trial, where a defendant can be sued by the opposing side’s attorney, even before any guilt or innocense has been determined by a jury or otherwise, ambulance chasers will be filing every piece of evidence they can to get the defendant charged in order to more easily win their civil lawsuits.
I still believe that Crump being so open and boasting about wanting to sue, for money damages for the Martin parent’s, even before any trial has occured, will turn many more people off than it will help Crump and the Martin’s. It clearly shows that this is not about Justice for Trayvon, it is about big bank accounts for the family. I don’t know that that has not been lost on many. I really do believe that seeing $$$$$ as an agenda’s is a turn off. IMO the settlement filing was a critical error on Crump’s part.
Tom Sadaka, an attorney with legal analyst Mark NeJame’s law firm, says the state is working to firm up its case against George Zimmerman.
“And I think the state is trying to get some type of predictability, from the defense with the assistance of the court, to say where they will be going with their defense in this case,” Sadaka said.
I’ve never even played a lawyer on TV, but shouldn’t they have firmed up the case and then filed charges?
I like the way you think 🙂
This makes zero sense to me. Anyone understand this?
Anybody got a guess as to who Witness V is?
O’Mara’s strategy at that first bond hearing was brilliant. The State was completely out in the dark. It should have ended right then and there. They have zero and said so under oath.
Someone commented that she told the defense in her depo that she was first contacted by Crump. IDK.
Jordan, this is like the fourth time I’m mentioning this to you. Do you have a problem hitting the reply button under the persons comment that you are responding to? You are posting independent comments as if they are replies without actually replying to anyone and it confuses the board. Please take care of that in future commenting.
Sorry, I misunderstood. Is this correct?
Very good, lol, no big deal or anything it just gets a bit disruptive to read through comments and come to ones out of nowhere that are apparently in reply to someone yet not. Thanks.
Recently, there has been a change in what I see in my email when responding. I now have to go up thread to find the post. It used to be at the bottom of my emails. It is a bit confusing in Yahoo but I got it now.
Ah, I see. So you are responding directly from your email rather than here on the board itself? If you have a WordPress account and sign in with that, a little speech bubble lights up when someone responds to you and you can respond from that as well, that way you don’t have to get emails if you rather not..
Thanks but I prefer the emails so I don’t miss any posts. I follow the case on several blogs.
I’m seeing the same thing.
The reply button in the notification email takes me directly to the generic reply box at the bottom of the page.
On other sites running WordPress.com’s software, doing that takes me to a reply box at the bottom of the page but it specifically says “Reply to (person who made the comment that triggered the notification email)”, and the reply winds up nested under, and indented from, that person’s post rather than leftmost and and under all previous posts.
So maybe it’s site owner choose-able how it handles it, although who knows what they call that option or where they’ve hidden it.
In other words, defense strategy is certainly attorney work product, no?
He would not file if he was not worried about it. He has a busted flush in his hand.
My guess is that Bernie is worried that the defense has obtained the Cell Tower Ping Logs that the prosecution refused either to obtain or reveal. The ping logs destroy the case. Bernie is screwed and he knows it.
Why else is he so worried about the defense “strategy.” If he had a case he would be piling evidence on Omara’s desk. Instead he moans and groans. I think he knows all Zimmerman has to do is sit there like a potted plant. That forces him to prove his case.
Can you picture playing poker with Bernie?
I still do not understand why the defense cannot get the Cell Tower Ping Logs on it own. On what grounds can the State withhold that? Has Mom filed a specific demand for the phone records and ping logs? What happened with the missing data from 2/26 that was “missing?” This is all crazy. It wouldn’t even be allowed on a TV crime show.
jordan2222 – the Defense gets the Cell Tower Ping Logs from the State if the State is in possession of them as they are part of the discovery & they can’t with hold them. I guess if the State claimed they never got Ping Logs, the Defense could file a MOTION to request the logs on their own like the Defense filed on the Social Media and school records they wanted on TM. Its difficult to obtain any information on another persons cell information for any reason, I assume it would take a court order signed by Judge N..
Everything is so vague on these ping logs, WHO knows? Too, we don’t know what the Defense has received since all the discovery isn’t released to the public. It is possible if the Defense is not requesting these outstanding pieces of discovery again, they may be in possession of them.
What a mystery. If the ping logs prove DeeDee was not on the phone with Trayvon, then the case would/should be dismissed so maybe she was and the defense knows it. That is really the only logical conclusion, given what we know.
I bring it up from time to time because so many folks have said the conversation never took place and seem convinced of that. IDK.
Waltherppk is really hot on this issue.
jordan2222 – I too am curious about the ping logs and I support Waltherppk’s passion on the issue and he is absolutely correct, but I still don’t know if the public will see them before trial. In Mrs. Z’s open letter to the public, she was so confident in the facts being presented, perhaps some of the facts are in the ping logs MOM/West may already have. MOM/West have again ask for the information the State downloaded off SZ/GZ’s cell phones, if they are outstanding why wouldn’t the ping logs be included if the Defense doesn’t possess them?
Robert ZImmerman Jr’s summary of baldy’s latest motion:
Robert Zimmerman JR
It is absurd: tell us your legal strategy or else.
04:08 PM – 24 Apr 13
I read the Jeff Weiner article about the state’s demand to know the defense trial plans but I have never seen the actual motion. Does anyone have a link to the state’s motion?
Here it is. http://www.gzlegalcase.com/index.php/court-documents/144-state-s-motion-requestion-court-inquiry-of-defendant
Thank you Nettles.
Hey Bernie: Let’s start with your showing us all of the evidence you plan to use at trial. Then give us the exculpatory evidence you have been hiding that proves George is innocent. Is that fair?
George’s big brother Bob’s wise advice: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AAhM26EKmrU
Sybrina Fulton: We Have Never Asked Anyone To Do Anything Out Of The Ordinary http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jc2miM4gkjU
Interesting. The Miami Dade firefighter who was demoted for posting on his facebook page about the lack of good parenting by Trayvon Martin’s parents has won his right to free speech.
A win for the good guys, a loss for the thugs and their enablers.
Sybrina fulton says it was all an accident http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y5sqZrCtfLM
After talking to big money crump-a-dump some more sybrina denies saying it was an accident http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Rg41Q61xB0
Watch Crumb’s body language (around the 4:40 mark) when Sybrina says she believes it was an accident… and boy he must have laid into her good after that because she is visibly shaken during the next interview.
Ok… my reply was supposed to be posted under LJS’s video link?
I must have caught Jordan’s replyitis 🙂
Jury notices will be going out soon to 500 people throughout the county.
But is it possible to have an unbiased jury decide the case?
News 13 legal analyst Mark Nejame said attorneys have a tough job ahead of them when picking a jury for the June trial.
An acquittal could spark protest, and it could have a long-term effect on Sanford and Seminole County, where the jurors live.
News 13 asked Nejame if that could factor into their decision.
“It can be a factor without question, and I think it is going to be incumbent on the parties, and the judge in this case, to have a sequestered jury the entire time. I think there will be people attempting to get to the jurors, through intimidation, by putting out information that might help bias or prejudice them.”
Zimmerman’s defense team could have asked for a change of venue, moving the case to a different county, but decided not to because they felt the case was too widely known for a change of venue to really have an effect.
I voted NO as to the question of bias. “With 500 jury summons expected to go out for George Zimmerman’s trial, is an unbiased jury possible?” So far 57% agree with me.
I sure as hell want to see this trial but don’t think I could watch 500 potential jurors being questioned. How many were there in the CA trial?
jordan2222 – In KC’s case, there certainly weren’t 500 potential jurors. KC had a jury of 12 instead of the 6 GZ will have and her Defense had a Jury Consultant. KC’s jury was brought into Orlando from Pinellas County, INSTEAD of moving the trial, or change of venue. KC’s case was consistently in the National Media daily and still is, a much higher profile case that GZ’s, KC too faced the death penalty in her case & most complained she was overcharged with the death penalty. Judge Perry set a time limit for voir dire, & both sides moved along smoothly..
KC’s mother committed PERJURY in the death penalty case but Burdick/Ashton CHOSE not to charge her with perjury, unlike the asinine Corey who has charged Shellie with perjury. imo, there should be some across the board consistency in FLa. Prosecutors should either charge ALL of those w/perjury that commit it, or fine them, but it is unfair for Prosecutors to pick & choose who they charge. It is vindictive, just the point Corey wanted to make. jmo.
I live in Pinellas and followed the CA trial but not to the extent I have followed this one. We have 2 local TV stations that have indicated they will televise voir dire but I think I will pass and follow it on the blogs. How much time has been set aside for that process?
I do hope George can afford a jury consultant but I still have faint hopes that jello is correct and there will be no trial.
This is the most unusual case I have ever followed. Although I have heard all of the excuses as to why, the law has been utterly ignored.
NOTHING makes sense if you are relying on the statutes as the law. We are actually watching a conspiracy unfold before our very own eyes and no one does a thing to stop it. Reverse the roles, and blacks would be in full riot mode and yet, they continue to control everything that has happened. Exactly who’s in charge? Have we become that afraid of them?
Cheery picking out of season. Not many Cherry’s. 500 to get 6.
Doc dump: (not sure how to do actual links, HTML?)
AMENDED NOTICE OF HEARING : http://www.gzdocs.com/documents/0413/042513_amended_noh_043013_2.pdf
REPLY TO STATE’S RESPONSE TO DEFENDANT’S MOTION FOR SANCTIONS AGAINST STATE ATTORNEY’S OFFICE FOR DISCOVERY VIOLATIONS : http://www.gzdocs.com/documents/0413/042513_reply_to_sanctions.pdf
AFFIDAVIT AS TO REASONABLE ATTORNEY’S FEES : http://www.gzdocs.com/documents/0413/042513_not_affidavit_fees.pdf
REDACTED MOTION TO ALLOW ADDITIONAL WITNESS DISCLOSURE : http://www.gzdocs.com/documents/0413/042513_motion_witness_disclosure.pdf
DEMAND FOR SPECIFIC DISCOVERY (Trayvon Martin’s Phone) : http://www.gzdocs.com/documents/0413/042513_discovery_demand.pdf
DEMAND FOR SPECIFIC DISCOVERY (Enhanced Audio) : http://www.gzdocs.com/documents/0413/042513_discovery_demand_2.pdf
STATE’S MOTION OBJECTING TO RELEASE OF VICTIM’S FAMILY PERSONAL INFORMATION & MOTION TO SEAL THE RECORDS PREVIOUSLY FILED : http://www.gzdocs.com/documents/0413/states_objection_family_info.pdf
STATE’S AMENDED NOTICE OF HEARING : http://www.gzdocs.com/documents/0413/states_amended_noh_043013.pdf
Is this about the standard for formatting comments D-man (or others) ?
If you’re talking about why your comment was in spam it was because of the amount of hyperlinks. I have changed that now so one can post 10 links but will get caught in the spam folder if there’s 11 or more.
New news on GZLegal.com:
These are a couple of my favorites.
RE: specific discovery demand by MOM on 911 call Tracy listened to & claimed “it wasn’t TM’s voice,” but ONLY to later claim it was.
Although MOM has requested the cleaned copy if one exist of the 911 call in which Tracy claimed “he recognized TM’s voice & cry for help once the recording had been cleaned up,” I read yesterday in some of the filings that “BDLR told MOM there was NOT an enhanced recording of the 911 call for Tracy to listen to.” Is MOM just putting this into the record so BDLR can’t later claim he never verbally told MOM this? MOM is smart NOT to take BDLR at his word on anything, another proven liar.
5 links in moderation. Let me out please!
Haha, same here. You can delete my post D-man if ejarra has the same links. Thanks.
Hi ejarra, From personal experience on other blogs, I have been told that WordPress will only allow one link at a time to go through without admin. approval. It is a pain in the butt, but better to post links individually so you don’t get caught in spamm folder.
With WordPress you can actually control how many links are allowed at a time. I bumped it up a bit now. I had it at five before so now it’s up to ten.
I have set you free but understand there is only one of me here.
I knew I should have done them individually. But I was in a hurry. 😦
Thanx anyway D-man.
THE DEFENSE: Sanction State for Attacks, from OS:
Sounds like it will be a busy, action packed day and I am counting on Nelson to clean up her act while she can
jordan2222 – I had the same thought about Judge N., will she clean up her act? I noticed while reading the filing by the Defense on Sanctions, one of the cases sited by MOM had gone to the Supreme Court, YIKES! MOM’s had a gut full of the games by the State, it’s about time. I am going to be irked if Judge N chooses to lecture MOM with BDLR on the attacks, imo, MOM has been professional & a gentlemen as opposed to the puerile behavior BDLR has displayed.. How can Judge N NOT sanction BDLR when the Orlando Legal Analyst openly criticized BDLR’s behavior in his response, BDLR’s bazaar behavior isn’t lost on those following the case.
Judge N acts if as if she has somewhere else more important to be than the hearings at times, cutting both the Defense & State off in different hearings, imo. She has a ton of work to review before the hearing, she too seems to have made up her mind before hearing arguments too, I guess she’s in too big of a hurry.
Just trying to get the train to the station on time. Regardless of Hell or High Water.
She is plain and simple…LAZY.
Something I really respected about Chief Judge Belvin Perry was that he consistently reminded BOTH the State & Defense that he READ EVERY DEPO, that NOTHING would be allowed in that wasn’t in the deposition.
With Judge N, she has a blank look on her face, I worry at times she hasn’t even read the MOTIONS before her for that hearing, I could be wrong but that empty look bothers me.
Re: the appeal. I don’t follow alot of cases but this business of Crump working in the background separate from the State really bothers me. I don’t know how wide spread it is, but at some point I would think the judicial system needs to address this. I don’t think it benefits the system in any way and I fear this is going to become a “trend”. Sure the appeal is about taking the dep of Crump, however, if W8 would have been handled properly in the first first place there would be no need to depose Crump. Nobody but the State should have been involved with W8. This was if the defense had any problems with the handling of W8 they could argue accordingly. In this instance, as it stands now, any problems the defense has with W8 cannot be cleared up because the judicial system is protecting Crump from answering. This is a two party game and Crump stuck himself in there as a third party in action, but the Judicial system is protecting him and therefore acts like he’s a ghost … cannot be seen or heard. I fear that more cases of any kind could use this as a tactic by EITHER SIDE, prosecution or defense. Imagine for a moment that MOM went on TV shortly after taking the case and said attorney for the parents of GZ found, interviewed and recorded an eyewitness to the shooting. And that this eyewitness blows the prosecution case out of the water. To me if someone finds of witness, before any formal statement that is either put in writing or recorded, should be turned over to the appropriate side. Granted this is AFTER the Probable Cause Affidavit was filed … but still. Right now that Probable Cause Affidavit is based in part on W8 who has since been caught lying twice either herself (being sick) or by those that presented her.(age). I just want to see this or any other fight come down to the counsel involved in heart of the case, not attorneys sitting no the fringes of a case.
ottawa925 – excellent comment. While Crump is being protected, he has a vested interest as MOM has pointed out, the $$$$$$$. Crump’s behavior seems like witness tampering imo but Bondi doesn’t see it that way. If, as you pointed out, W8 had been handled correctly from the beginning, there would be no reason to depose Crump.
This decision by the DCA will only set a precedent of some sort and be used as a case site in other cases. What I want is a firm established for lack of better phrase … “chain of command” when it comes to a witness. It was not Crump’s job to depose her for the State’s case. It was up to Crump to pick up the phone and tell the State that I believe we have a witness that was on the phone with Trayvon just prior to his being shot. That’s it. Then step back. Not only did he not do that, he set up this whole scenario where time is being wasted on HIS PART in this rather than the defense just working on their case. Other than the BGI angle to make money off this case, We can argue all day long about the term “opposing counsel”. Is Jose Baez opposing counsel? or any of the other attorneys representing witnesses in this case considered “opposing counsel”. IDK. All I know is that the State filed the charges and they have the lone obligation to prove GZ guilty. I just want to see this situation of an attorney who is not the State and not the defense going around finding, interviewing and recording witnesses stopped. If you find one you keep your trap shut (the press) and just turn them over to the State or defense. Certainly not what happened in this case and I fear this is going to be a new trend, especially with these BGI cases, but surely doesn’t mean other type cases can’t do same.
LOL the defense filed a motion asking for crumps cleaned up enhanced 911 tape hahahahahaha
Back a little while ago I had commented that the defense should request the cleaned up 911 call that Crump claims caused Tracy to change his mind. That way the defense forces Crump and/or the state to admit once again that Crump lied. Low and behold, there it is today. I love it. I cannot wait to hear what BDLR or Guy have to say about the non-existent cleaned up recording.
There is no question in my mind but to believe that the state wishes it never heard the name Benjamin Crump before. He has proven to be a major liability to them. I bet Pam Bondi wishes she never made public statements on TV saying that Crump was her good friend, and that he was a fine lawyer. I bet Corey regrets saying that she prayed with those sweet sweet parents, and that she was seeking “justice for Trayvon.” They have all dug themselves into such a very deep hole that they cannot possibly crawl themselves out of it at this point.
It is thrilling to see that the defense has filed a motion to strike the state’s reply to his request for sanctions. Even many in the legal community could not believe that any prosecutor’s office would submit such an abomination of a document to a court. I was also happy to see that they actually named Ms. Corey, and said that this insulting, demeaning, and disparaging diatribe was submitted to the court under her name as the prosecutor. Haven’t seen any references to Corey directly in the past.
Was the document which named Harold Uhrig as being punished for unethical behavior the same Uhrig that said GZ had disappeared, questioned his mental state, and said that he and his partner were not taking his case, even though they were never hired? If so, it’s interesting that his name comes up in a court filing by the defense.
Crump files a confidential agreement in the criminal case and then files a memorandum of law saying it is inadmissable LOL DERP!!!!
“…there is only one of me here.”
How many of you are there elsewhere?
: – )
lolz, I’ll leave that one up to the physicists.
“lolz, I’ll leave that one up to the physicists.”
Just make sure none of them have a cat.
lolz, (me looking in the mirror opening and closing my eyes) I’m dead, I’m alive, I’m dead, I’m alive, I’m dead, I’m alive
I didn’t see this link listed above, but I may have just missed it.
Crump claims that there will be several witnesses who will identify that it was TM crying for help. If it’s the two outfits that were mentioned long ago, they won’t be any help in proving anything. One of the outfits is trying to sell his still faulty and unreliable equipment. Hey, maybe one of the witnesses will be Mary Cutchner (sp), who didn’t see anything while it was happening. I’m confident the defense can knock that one right out.
Then Crump claims that the defense is trying to draw attention away from events that happened that night by arguing about a settlement agreement? Is this guy’s head even attached at the shoulders? Crump- Why did you even file the settlement agreement with the criminal court? Was it to try to shoddily try to indicate that the estate got a settlement so therefore GZ was guilty of murder? Ha, he must be taking some heat from the HOA in filing the document to begin with as he is jumping through hoops to try to shield their names.
A new name was included in the signature area as an additional attorney for the estate of TM, Jarian N. Lyons. What happened to Darryl Parks? Has he distanced himself from the braindead Crump?
I said before and I’ll say it again, Crump is proving to be a major liability to the state. Lie down with dogs………………
Lyons’s name was on something else Crump filed not too long ago, but I forget what just now.
Even if they could exlude Zimmerman as being the yeller or screamer (although I’m not certain that we don’t hear both of them with voices raised), that, with no samples of Martin’s voice available, doesn’t prove there wasn’t a third unseen party out there making those sounds.
I still want to know if just any old body can file unrelated documents in conjunction with the criminal case.
Crump is the Probable Cause and every other element of the state’s case. If he is deposed under oath. You figger it out.
What happened to Darryl Parks? I was wondering that, too.
Doesn’t Crump’s #7 solidify the fact that the names of those who reached a settlement and how much each got is imperative for the defense to know in considering witnesses who may be motivated to lie about Trayvon’s screams for help. Crump tells the court other witnesses are willing to testify to that. Well are they party to the settlement? The settlement must be unsealed to know for sure.
Isn’t this exactly why civil cases usually occur after the criminal case so it doesn’t hurt or taint the testimony of the witnesses. That Crump and Company are so eager to get while the getting is good, tells me they know this case is on a house of cards.
What personal family info was released by the defense? The fact that Crump filed settlement document with the court, and wanted it to remain under seal, despite the fact that it was purposely leaked to the Fla. news sources, who happened to catch it in the 5 seconds it was posted on the court site? I personally happen to agree with Crump when he says that the state’s case will be harmed if the info is released. No one likes money hungry people who wanted to cash in on the death of their son. That could have the opposite effect of what Crump originally intended, to make GZ look guilty of murder because they got money for that.
I hope the defense takes the ten days they were given to reply to the 5th DCA. Please let it hang over the court, and the judge’s head on 4/30.
See Page 9 of this filing. You’ll note the address that Tracy Martin gave Sanford Police as where Trayvon was living. Interesting to note, this address is the former address he shared with Alicia. http://www.gzdocs.com/documents/0413/mot_to_unseal.pdf
DEMAND for Specific Discovery:
RE: Phone information
MOM requested: downloads, reports, from any phone # or phone # connected to TM or any information the State Attorney or LE has, retrieved, received, or investigated concerning data regarding TM’s phone, phones, and/or phone number’s..
After MOM said they garnered a “trove of information from TM’s phone,” I had assumed the Defense had all this information. Apparently they don’t & WHY hasn’t BDLR turned this over?
I have asked that question so many times, I can’t believe it. Some have implied that MOM has all that he needs, so IDK
This motion could imply they are aware of another phone or phones. I tend to think there are more than 1 for the lad. This number doesn’t match up with the one he tweeted.
Nettles – you make a good point of a different cell phone & the tweets possibly coming from that phone, something I hadn’t thought about. The phone aspect drives me crazy in this case but I realize it’s an important aspect of who TM was. I am looking forward to seeing what the Defense found in the social media during the trial.
Here’s a great recap from investigative reporter Tony Pipitone of Local 6 news.
Thank you and yes it’s a great recap. Did you notice this comment?
Kar Vooj • 39 minutes ago
Omara to file for change of venue
Z publicly fires Omara while privately Omara recuses himself.
jordan2222 – I read the comments there and I see that particular blogger accused of having several different screen names, LOL, the other night when someone addressed Kar Vooj, they included the other alias names in the reply calling him or her out. Some bloggers do the same at the OS, they change their screen name several times but the mantra is the same. Mung comments a lot at Click Orlando and he’s always interesting & doesn’t let the GZ haters get by with their lies,
This is a major problem I have with Pipitone’s article-
(When you read thousands of pages of court documents, it’s easy to skim over minor variations in what appears to be boilerplate language – and, the state notes, the defense never verbally mentioned their videotape plans to them.)
I doubt that many would disagree that this case has been anything but “boilerplate.” If the state effed up that is their problem. The defense did everything they were legally required to do. Even the judge seemed to get a clue about that in ruling in their favor, albeit reluctantly for sure.
Just to add to my comment , I believe that the abbreviated depo of DD was not video taped. I am also unclear that the following depos of Sybrina, Tracy and Rhonquavis were videoed as well, if they actually took place. I remember reading that the short depo of DD was only audio recorded.
Yes, that’s my understanding too. After 5 hours, and not being able to get in touch with Judge, the defense agreed to proceed without videotaping. There was no issue with the March 14th and 15th depos so I assume by that time, they got the Judge’s ruling allowing video-taping.
That the Judge was unavailable that day when she knew the deposition was scheduled leaves me feeling uneasy. I find myself in unfamiliar territory. I don’t trust those in power. I have zero trust.
” I don’t trust those in power. I have zero trust.”
Not meant sarcastically Nettles, but, ya think there just might be something untoward goin’ on here? IMO, that’s a given.
I bet this ruined BDLR’s weekend, affidavits from practicing Attorney’s in Orlando and their fees, Hornsby’s on there, LOL! Guess that will give BDLR an idea about what is fair.
There are a couple of TV commentators on there. Is this a subtle way of telling BDLR about the upcoming mood of the coverage? Journalists, like everyone else, don’t like being lied to and Crump and Company are now caught putting so much misinformation out through the media. ie: W8 is a minor. Sunny Hostin was told W8 gave a sworn affidavit to Mr. Crump on March 19th and now she learns she took that lie to air.
I sure as hell hope enough journalists are embarrassed by reporting Crump’s lies that they rise up and retaliate with some truthful reports. It would be nice to see them expose Crump for who and what he really is. Yes, I know they have a responsibility to do some fact checking first but they relied on him and made liars of themselves.
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