MDSPD and the George Zimmerman Case – Intro

We are only beginning to understand all the aspects of what went down with the MDSPD in regards to the Zimmerman case but to say the least it’s, well, just from what little we have so far it has me floored, I just don’t know what to say but there’s going to be lot’s said that’s for sure. For now I’ll just leave you with some of the comments I made at the treehouse.

SPD Sgt. Randy Smith got 8 pages from the MDSPD regarding Trayvon Martin on Feb 29, 2012.

Smith if you recall was the one that was mentioned as being a possible exception to the unanimous position that there was insufficient evidence to charge George and was the one who signed off on the capias.

Sundance reports that was only one report and there were others regarding Trayvon the MDSPD had that may have not been received by Smith.

“Example: Officer “Tagle” a hispanic male, gave FDLE Joanne Velez (Systems analyst – Supervisor in Charge) of FDLE information about Trayvon Martin in addition to the information given to Sanford Police’s Randy Smith…Where’s that report?”

Now, the critical question. Since Smith got these 8 pages on the 29th what did he do with them? There is nothing mentioned about these reports in Serinos final report, nothing about the MDSPD or Smith.

You can’t tell me what was in these 8 pages would not have been in Serinos report to some extent, even just mentioning their existence, especially in the victimology section, which is very short and doesn’t mention the MDSPD or R. Smith and you can’t tell me if everyone in the SPD were informed on these 8 pages, especially Serino, that would not have affected the investigation to some degree.

What is critical to know now is what did Smith do with these 8 pages? Did Serino get them while he was conducting his investigation?

The fundamental racial and ideological aspects are also critical to understanding WHY this is the way it is which is talked about in the links below and will no doubt be talked about again.

I’m sure there will be much more to come, god help me, lol.

NOTE: I will not tolerate Sundance/Treehouse bashing, take that crap to the Trayvonite blogs or your own blog.

NOTE: Post off-topic Zimmerman comments here:

Thanks to the Last Refuge, Sundance and the people who donated to bring us these reports.

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38 thoughts on “MDSPD and the George Zimmerman Case – Intro

    • Both requested and faxed on the same day:

      “according to the sworn statement by Hadley he sent it to Smith on February 29th – 8 pages from the investigative division of M-DSPD with the following notation:

      …”This is all we have on your victim. Please contact Darrell Dunn, he’s the SRO [School resource officer] at Dr. Michael Drop, Sr., where your victim attended high school. Officer Dunn would have first-hand knowledge of Martin as well as put you in touch with his teachers and the school’s administration”…”

          • Right, is that not the day that Serino told GZ that TM was a good student and had good grades or something to that effect? I am going to check Txantimedia’s transcripts when I get home.
            The working assumption right now is that Serino did not received the 8 pg. report, I am wondering if Serino knew about the report or that they were asking for it that day.

              • The thing is the SPD was convinced that TM was the aggressor, and they were right, even through all the pressure that was being exerted the Chief, was convinced that they were right, none of the usual hedging. I am thinking they did have the information, in that case what happened to it?

                • I think SPD is in that position, whether or not it has a report from M-DSPD relating to Martin. They did not have Witness 8. Everything they had was consistent with Zimmerman’s account.

                  I have exactly the same question you do about “what happened to it?” It should be in SPD case files, all of which are discoverable by defense.

                  • Cbolt, I am wondering is the SPD felt they could not use or reference the report since it was obtain informally not due to a warrant or subpoena, as such it could not be part of the official record. I see that the FDLE were aware since they followed up on it, but if I remember correctly they had a subpoena issued.

                    • To the best of my knowledge, there is no barrier to inter-law-enforcement-agency sharing. SPD can obtain criminal records from other state law enforcement agencies. The Feds erect a barrier, but that’s because they are investigating a separate crime, and protecting their own investigation and legal process. The barrier that M-DSPD tried to erect (toward SPD) was on a bogus legal theory.

                      I don’t believe FDLE issued a subpoena to M-DSPD, and FDLE are obliged to deliver evidence to the defense as a matter of open book discovery. When O’Mara caught them withholding evidence, he petitioned the court for a subpoena, was first turned down becuase he could go get the info himself, then petitioned again with a list of specific items.

                    • I understand, I was trying to reconcile the missing information. The FDLE did subpoena TM school records, I remember seeing it in one of the discovery drops.

                      The distinction that MDSPD created was bogus the chief lost his job over it. I was just thinking that if the SPD did not know this they may have felt they were in violation of FERPA.

  1. Administrivia (blog management headaches), the nettles18 thread is closed to comments. I assume you’ll want to remedy that, since you are directing people to post there 😉 This remark is, of course, junk after that’s been done, so please, by all means, delete it!

  2. and the relevance is….what?
    big waste of time and money IMHO.
    of course kids in high school are given a break. we try to keep them straight the best we can and not ruin their lives. don’t you want that for your own children?

    • Federal and state laws determine how discipline versus criminal incidents are documented and reported by school district. It is not arbitrary of up to some person perspective about ruining some kids lives. nonsense talk. 17 year old high school males are both killing and being killed daily in today America. The remedy for this nightmare DOES not include your misplaced concern or logic. Any qualified educator or capable parent understands the first police contact is where to start meaningful behavioral intervention. I hope you are not a parent.

    • Steve, do you really support the manipulation of criminal data so that the MDSPD can claim lower crime rates? Do you also support manipulating grades so that the school system can claim improved student performance?

      • The documented mindset leads a kid to think they can do just about anything and nothing is going to happen to them. It obviously was true for Trayvon. For quite some time, schools have received criticism on this issue. Kids who tho underage are committing crimes, and kids without outright behavior issues .. are protected and just shuffled from “special” schools, or classes. It has been discussed and criticized, yet there is no push to stop the madness. The only message being sent is there will be no demand of accountability either from the student or parents. No penalty either. So there is no incentive to “straighten up and fly right”. This documentation confirms what we had suspected. It’s nice to have the confirmation on paper tho.

    • If you think what I post is not relevant then why are you here.

      If you think what I post is not relevant and are questioning why I post it then you will have to be specific.

  3. For some reason I’m unable to post on CTH right now, not sure why. I had trouble logging on here as well for a few minutes. Anyway, I had asked there if Trademark’s records had been manipulated prior to Sanford Police’s request for the records or if the records had been manipulated while satisfying the police request. Does anyone know?

    • Answered here too, just to make this thread stand on its own. The report of the stolen jewelry was falsified at the time it was made. Rather than report jewelry in juveniles posession and confiscated, the report was as though the jewelry was found just sitting there.

  4. hi tara:
    no to your second question. not criminal data, so your first question makes no sense. that is the whole point.
    All i am saying here is that we have to be reasonable. The jails are full of “criminals” as a result of the drug war. This great system we have has put millions of people in jail, and now not just black people. It is an assault on the poor of society. There is a recent PBS film from Independent Lens which documents the tragedy of applying laws (and sentencing guidelines) too strictly. We incarcerate more people than any other nation. Incarceration is big business in America. If you build it, they will come.
    When bureaucrats apply the laws too strictly we all suffer. There are hundreds of examples of ridiculous applications of the law. Surely we can think clearly and perhaps handle cases in a more humane manner. What if all cops went strictly by the books? What kind of society would we have?
    How many people here have been given a break about some petty matter? Smoking marijuana, if you are not aware, is a part of growing up. Should we lock up every kid caught smoking marijuana and throw away the key? Or maybe only if they are black? Then that would be OK? Being facetious here in case you don’t get the drift.

    • Prosecution and punishment are discretionary activities. It is possible to make an honest report of the incident or contact, and impose ZERO penalty. In the case of jueveniles who make it to adulthood, the record is virtually sealed, so there is no history to harm them.

      I’m sure the dishonest police leadership and participants rationalized thier dishonesty as being in the best interests of society. But we see here an unintended side effect, where a defendant in a criminal case is opposing an adversary with a ficticious history. No reasonable person can support that.

    • I understand your point about drug laws but this incident is a burglary as in breaking and entering, theft and a is felony. This also just happens to be the crime of which GZ considered Martin may have been considering when he observed him loitering and lurking about in the rain and why he called the police. GZ has been excoriated as “profiling” TM as a possible burglar when his records show he WAS a suspected burglar. GZ is being accused of being correct.

    • I’m not suggesting that we put the kids in prison. I am suggesting that we report their crimes accurately. What’s the purpose of reporting if the reports are false? Would love to hear your opinion on this.

    • Steve, would you agree schools have rules? The rules are not for certain students .. they are for ALL students. We have RULES all through life. To me it is the job of the school to educate. That’s it. Not indoctrinate, not psycho analyze your kid, or rehabilitate your kid. That’s for the parents to do. If you see your kid has problems with authority figures, or rules and regs, it’s time to sit down and find out what’s going on with YOUR kid. Too much time is being spent by schools trying to figure out why kids have problems. Let a parent take the kid to a psychiatrist <that's what they do … try to figure out why you are having problems. Right now the way I see it, the schools just dumb everything down so that even the truly stupid can pass. This is not helping kids in my mind. Why do homework? Why go to class when you know that you will make a living selling dope? or stealing and fencing the stolen goods. These troubled kids figure they are on the fast track so no need to go through the motions of an education. I'm totally against coddling these kids. Hey, you like to mess up at school? … then it's time to take your phone away, your computer, your ipads and everything else that is a distraction. Go sit in your room and look at the walls.

    • It is quite common that sentencing for minor offenses includes intervention programs (drug, alcohol, anger management, scared straight type programs). Sometimes the programs work, but they are guaranteed not to work if they are not used.
      You can look at it as an “assault on the poor of society”, but you need to consider that nobody has forced these young men into a life of crime, or forced them to commit criminal activities. Teenagers often lack impulse control, but if they are raised in a good home with morals, values, respect, reponsibility, rules,and guidelines, they are better equiped to make sound judgement calls. Sometimes bad kids come from good homes, but a kid from a good home has a better chance of getting help. Even poor kids from broken homes can be raised to be a responsible adult, look at Dr. Ben Carson as an example. To think that the strict application of the law creates criminals is completely false. Typically a first offender of a minor offense, gets a slap on the wrist, but to not punish them at all (or even acknowledge that they have done anything wrong) is simply condoning their behavior.

    • See my comment directly above. This is apples and oranges, Stave. I’m talking about reporting. Statistics. You’re talking about punishment.


    Randy Smith was a sergeant, and in charge of investigations at the time of the TM/GZ incident. He was promoted to lieutenant shortly before Chief Lee left. I wonder if Chief Lee knew about the 8 page document?

    If I am not mistaken, isn’t the City Manager Bonaparte in charge of the SPD, from the chief on down. It would seem that he had to approve the promotions, including that of Randy Smith. Bonaparte and Triplett were on the Justice for Trayvon bandwagon early on. Triplett went right over Chief Lee’s head, and released the 911 tapes to the Martin’s and/or Crump.

    The reporter linked above asked BDLR if they were going to start over with the investigation, or build on the SPD investigation. With everything else that the prosecution has hidden, including FDLE reports, I wouldn’t be surprised in the least to find that the prosecutors office insured that the school reports grew legs. I wonder what the date was that Crump filed the paperwork to have the school records sealed? No wonder Crump/Sybrina/Tracy came out right from the beginning and said that TM had never been arrested. I’m sure they were aware of how TM’s “incidents” were handled with the school police.

    School Police Chief Hurley had asked at least one officer not to arrest any black males. The officer defied him and said that if he had probable cause he would arrest whoever was guilty of committing a crime. Does that mean that black youth crime was that high in Miami Dade? Does that mean that it was OK to arrest those of any other race?

    Chris Serino had already admitted that he was pressured into filing charges against GZ. It is my opinion that he did see the 8 page report, but with the pressure he was under, made that report go away, and likely had Randy Smith help him to do it. If Smith was the head of investigations at the time of the incident, wouldn’t it have been him that made Serino the lead investigator?

    Sorry for the whole bunch of random thoughts.

    • Great job in getting the FOIA documents from the internal investigations of the Miami Dade School Police. Applause to Sundance and crew for a great job. Thanks to all who donated to make it possible.

      So these documents explain why Trayvon’s record isn’t actually accurate. Dunn appears to know Trayvon and had several incidents with him. To get an accurate record, he’ll have to have a talk with the defense.

      Also what if anything did the FDLE SIC get? Did she follow up with Chief of Police?

      Trayvon’s parents said they were never told about the jewelry incident. Does the fudging of the incident include not telling the parents too? How do they expect to get a change in behavior if the parents aren’t told?

      There is no way all this is going on with their son and they haven’t got a clue. Again, I get so angry when I think of Tracy leaving that boy alone in the City of Sanford for everyone else to deal with. Travyon was on suspension for the 3rd time. I think he may have been expelled. I read in one of the documents he was a former student of Krop. Is he former because he had died? I don’t think so. I think that explains why the students weren’t told right away. It’s irresponsible of the prinicipal and faculty to not provide any help for the kids who would have been close to him upon learning of his death. The students weren’t officially told until March 21st and at the time they were told, Trayvon was described as a student. More cover-up?

      In the Fab. 29th interview Serino tells GZ that he shot a good kid. Is that the feedback Smith gave Sernio that day? It was clear Serino had did some investigation on both George and Trayvon prior to that interview.

      This case is much bigger than George Zimmerman. Please help George expose this. Donate to the defense. They are running a deficit.

  6. Like being punished by your parents for something you didn do, she said last week, in response to rumors that have variously portrayed her as a taskmistress who foists dietdrug cocktails on her clients to whittle them into sample sizes and as suffering herself from an eating disorder that has ravaged her tiny frame.

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